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#1
Old 31-08-2010, 20:31
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Ask A Question Forum
When is it a good position to buff scouts during free time aka round start.
On badlands i buff scouts before they go on the stairs, dont know if this is correct or not.
Anyway i was wondering when should a medic buff scouts on maps like bl, gran, freight?
#2
Old 31-08-2010, 20:32
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Bowt
it will depend on your spawn a bit but if you can buff scouts you can achieve a significant advantage if your scouts arrive to mid on 150hp and the other teams scouts are unbuffed.

You can workout the time to buff yourself - just do some rollouts with your teams scouts!

In pg days we had the most rediculous advantage with scout health and demoman speed that we could instantly win rollouts because the other teams scouts would play aggressive even tho their demoman was slower, were on 125 hp against scouts that were 150+ hp and could aim better. Sounds strange but I dont know many scouts who have even thought about that on badlands rollout and we are talking div1 scouts from every other team.

I used to think of badlands rollout initially as a bit of a duel between the demoman and scouts for elements of positioning and damage. The dynamics of rollouts on badlands have changed since then but having buff when you reach mid is important.

I think the medics healing on rollout can be so important and we put in alot of effort with it and it definately pays off
#3
Old 31-08-2010, 20:32
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Quote:
Originally Posted by No Mercy
Buffing scouts at the very start of the rollout is not worth it. Id be impressed if a medic even remembered to buff both soldiers before their first rocket jump, like on badlands, when the heal to 300 is pretty fast. A successful rollout by many international standards has 2 soldiers getting to middle with 300hp (unless theres a totally off medic bombing soldier). I doubt any team in Australia successfully rolls out under this criteria, and soldiers really need to think more about how they rollout within a team dynamic.

On rollouts themselves there's no golden answer ot buffing scouts, but as late as possible while within range is better. Obviously the later you leave it then they will be too far ahead of you. What you're doing on the stairs is fine. On granary often a passive left scout can wait for a buff once you get to mid, etc. Generally what i like to do is the first thing i do once reaching the middle is give the 1 close scout a good helping of heals so long as noone is in critical. Ideally they have taken no damage, but either way its gives them a chance to try and make a low risk prod at the cluster, or take a scout duel.

When deciding who to heal , remember that scouts are the fastest players and so can get back into fights or chase faster, and have 125hp to start. Think about total hitpoints pool when healing, not pool percentage full. So buff scouts first in free play ALWAYS. Most medics do not do this enough, and even worse ive regularly had to call scout to come for buffs when i slut medic. With this in mind buffing scouts in general play when they are on 125 hp is great because you can count on it likely being a fast heal.

A soldier needs heals fast the lower is hit points are, a scout is in many ways the reverse.

Try to not get into the habit though of compromising you own movement for them.
#4
Old 31-08-2010, 20:33
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Quote:
Originally Posted by hatchet
~not a mentor~
Jaeger/Creepin badlands rollout (medic pov) has some general tips - http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WCzCJcQjxPY

In media central (http://ozfortress.com/media/) you can see stv/povs from most of the div1 teams (and there should be some medic pov's as well if you want to compare).
#5
Old 31-08-2010, 23:25
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I try to hit the scouts as I jump off the platform on badlands and then going up the stairs but I have a feeling that the buff wears off by the time they hit mid.

Same for the crossover heals @ second on follower (the mid is so far away) and obscure (no chance unless they stick with you and go high right straight into the demo).
#6
Old 31-08-2010, 23:32
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as an ex-scout i prefer healing scouts over every other member of my team but they dont like that so i have to share my heals and only heal the scouts when i get that heal bonus thing because it takes like 2 second to hels them from 5 hp to 185 man that suvh a cool thing valve implemented here i'll link it here
http://www.teamfortress.com/post.php?id=1656
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#7
Old 1-09-2010, 04:29
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On badlands you can heal the scouts just as they are running up the steps (usually by the time you reach bottom main door enterence) and they should reach the mid fight both with 150 health easily.

From that you'll learn to judge the general distance of the beam and be able to figure out where exactly you can 'tap' your scouts for a buff at the rollout of granary, freight, and any other 5cp map.

During a massive shit fight between your primary and demo healing scouts should be a pretty low priority - remember due to their speed they can easily run off and grab a med pack and come back like they never left their position to begin with.

Buffing scouts is best done when your primary and demo aren't fighting - and in those situations good scouts will come to you ONLY during that time because...

a - your attention isn't further divided between your primary, demo, dodging and calling
b - if they need health, chances are they are low on health (fucking DUH) and will probably get inadverently killed running towards you when there's spam being thrown between heavies.

It is, of course - like anything in life - completely situational and you'll eventually boil down all medic healing rotation into 1 simple rule.

Whichever class is needed at the specific time gets the heals.
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#8
Old 1-09-2010, 10:22
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In terms of buffing scouts on rollout, you want to do it at just before max range. Not sure of the exact distance but for an estimate on granary i think it's from the tyre on 1st point near the left pipe to the wall just before the roller door. Overheals for scouts on rollout does not really matter that much on granary, but bowt will have a sook if he doesn't have them.

On badlands it's seemingly more important as the time to middle is alot shorter and that extra 20 odd health can make a scout take an extra scattergun shot and essentially win the rollout because of it. Heals on rollout (badlands) usually go in the order of Demo till he does his jump OUT of spawn, roamer as he does first jump -> scouts (this is usually at stairs) -> roamer -> pocket then just prioritise heals at mid depending on who's doing what. This rollout assumes that your pocket is doing the equaliser rollout (that is, doing 2 rj's in spawn instantly, equalising to just out of dropdown, then healing him there).

Kinda hard to explain in words, though hope that helps.
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#9
Old 1-09-2010, 10:43
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What Yuki said, but you should be able to overheal all three heavies before they do their freezetime jumps, then lock onto the demo until he jumps out of spawn. If you can't get both sollies to 300hp (and you won't be able to, if they jump too early or the scouts are being retarded spastics and jumping in front of your heal beam) then prioritise getting the demo fully buffed before he jumps out.
#10
Old 1-09-2010, 11:35
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fastheal isn't really that necessary during freeztime on soldiers because a) one of them is doing equaliser and will slow down near mid and b) the gunboats soldier will be going slowly anyway so you'll be healing him most of the time, so both soldiers will be 300 in mid.
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#11
Old 1-09-2010, 12:10
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True, we haven't started doing equilizer rollouts yet, I hadn't actually seen it until Theyleon showed me in one of our SoO scrims. (We're too busy looking up porn to keep up-to-date with modern rollouts)
#12
Old 20-09-2011, 16:28
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Bumping this thread because I've had a few queries from new players about healing rotation on rollouts.

For the people who are new to competitive tf2, or those that don't play medic often (e.g. you only play it in tf2pug) here's a video of bonobo's pov on cp_granary in owl6 showing the basic healing rotation (ty bonobo).

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=IlZV6AqR9-E

The general gist on cp maps is currently.
  1. Heal the demo till they're out of your reach
  2. Overheal scouts to 185hp *
  3. Heal the soldier who didn't use equaliser to 300hp
  4. Heal the soldier who did use equaliser on rollout
* As Yuki said earlier, "In terms of buffing scouts on rollout, you want to do it at just before max range"
Last edited by hatchet; 20-09-2011 at 16:35.
#13
Old 20-09-2011, 19:14
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http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dZHrAtoV1hA&t=2m10s
#14
Old 21-09-2011, 18:26
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on gran:

demoman till out of range, scout 1, scout 2, catch the non-equalizing soldier who should be right above you

on bads:

demoman till out of range, scout 1, scout 2, soldier
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#15
Old 21-09-2011, 20:14
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gullywash?

I always have trouble getting the order right on gullywash, since the rollout is so much shorter.
#16
Old 21-09-2011, 20:18
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Demo as much as you can, should be able to get non eq sold before he jumps, get scouts after him, eq sold just after you get to rollers if you go right, or after the other soldier jumps if you go left.
#17
Old 23-09-2011, 09:42
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1. heal demo until they have jumped to door
2. tap 2nd solly to 260 before he jumps (there is a wasted gap healing the demo before you can move)
3. heals on demo for max overheal so he can jump
4. underpass heal scouts
5. hit stairs and heal 2nd solly
6. heal second solly until equalizer crit heal is ready.

Scouts arrive 140~, solly bombs on 275-300~, primary solly has full buff.
Last edited by eko; 23-09-2011 at 09:45.
#18
Old 23-09-2011, 19:28
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sol-ly

sol-dier

Same rules apply to each map really... Heal priority is always on demo + scouts with the roamer being 2nd last and pocket being last. Pretty elementary folks
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#19
Old 23-09-2011, 20:03
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most heal rotations are bungled by players taking self damage at the wrong times, or too much, rather than the medic clicking on them in some order.
#20
Old 24-09-2011, 16:05
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People getting all bunched up or running in a line also makes it difficult to find the right target at the right time (I play Medic because I can't aim dammit!)
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#21
Old 24-09-2011, 17:40
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try and get your teammates to lane left or right at particular times depending on who needs the heal. eg: on granary during the rocket area after respawn door, demo stays left, everyone else right.
#22
Old 25-09-2011, 17:06
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Quote:
Originally Posted by povohat View Post
try and get your teammates to lane left or right at particular times depending on who needs the heal. eg: on granary during the rocket area after respawn door, demo stays left, everyone else right.
yeah the amount of times I've seen demo rollouts fucked by a scout bumping him, especially through badlands dropdown window. Or equalising soldier on stairs.

Just move the fuck out of the way
#23
Old 2-10-2011, 10:27
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HOLY SHIT AT SCOUTS JUMPING IN SPAWN... RAGHKSRHRRAAAHH
#24
Old 2-10-2011, 12:57
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hey man scout jumping in spawn was the correct move in 2008 (teammates absorbed friendly splash, for the new kids)
#25
Old 3-10-2011, 09:35
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hahaha, scouts jumping to see demo oh god those were the days.
#26
Old 3-10-2011, 18:57
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Quote:
Originally Posted by eko View Post
hahaha, scouts jumping to see demo oh god those were the days.
what?

scouts jumped so they didnt absorb rockets and prevent solds from freeze time jumps
#27
Old 4-10-2011, 23:59
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Wackety View Post
what?

scouts jumped so they didnt absorb rockets and prevent solds from freeze time jumps
it's actually a joke regarding that.
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